S01 - E04 - Jack and the British army

In today's episode, I talk with Jack about his career in the British army and experience serving in the Afghanistan conflict.

S01 - E04 - Jack and the British army

Full intermediate level ESL podcast transcript

Support the show (https://www.patreon.com/lovetolearnenglish)

Richard: Hey, Jack, how are you? 

Jack: I’m great thanks. 

Richard: All right...Welcome to the podcast. Today we're going to talk a bit about your famous army career. So Jack, what made you join the army and how did you join? 

Jack: Well, the joining process in itself, uh, it depends really, I went to the army career center to join up...and...but the reason why I joined is actually more important. The reason why I joined, uh...is because I needed to change my track a bit.  As, you know, when we were younger, we were quite, well... children hanging around in the parks.

Richard: Yeah… (laughs) ...parks of Newport.

Jack: ...Parks of Newport have been naughty.  But, uh, obviously I had to change my track a bit. So hence my mum - my mother, and my father. They...you know, told me about this army career thing. (I) Checked it out...started training for it and then just went to a selection board. 

Richard: Um, so just to go back there, you said that you wanted to change your track. What do you mean by track? You mean path…? Your…?

Jack: That's right...The path. So, so...so everyone in life has a path that they want to follow. Some people like to certainly include academia. Um, go to university, uh, my path was more..live life to its fullest while you are young, well hopefully it works out for the best. 

Richard: Yeah...So not from your parents' point of view ... not the best...(laughs) the best idea.  Um, okay. So...the army obviously is a big institution. Um, what was your role and your *rank?

What did you do within the army? 

NOTE - Your Rank in the army means your position. There are 13 enlisted Army ranks: Private, Private Second Class, Private First Class, Specialist, Corporal, Sergeant, Staff Sergeant, Sergeant First Class, Master Sergeant, First Sergeant, Sergeant Major, Command Sergeant Major, and Sergeant Major of the Army.

Jack: So initially when I joined up into the army, uh, obviously I went to training, uh, while in training, uh, you’re new, as they refer to you as a Crow bag. A Crow bag in the army is known as newbies. Um, they refer to them as crows because...as you’re new, you will flap* a lot or you will basically….how'd you, how'd you put it? (Ponders) You will basically….Uhh…

(The bird pictured above is a crow.)

Richard: So yeah, we need to explain a few things here. 

NOTE - To flap means to move arms or wings up and down. E.G the bird flapped its wings and flew away.

Jack: Yeah…

Richard: So, a crow is a type of bird... 

Jack: That’s right. 

Richard: ...that's black, a black bird. 

Jack: That’s right. 

Richard: Uhmm and to flap is when a bird moves its wings. 

Jack:  That's right. 

Richard: Right...so the movement of a bird swing is to flap. 

Jack: Yeah…

Richard:  Um, so the idea is, is that you *struggle.. is that it…? 

NOTE - to struggle - to experience difficulty and make a very great effort in order to do something:

The dog had been struggling to get free of the wire noose.

I've been struggling to understand this article all afternoon.

Fish struggle for survival when the water level drops in the lake.

Jack: So.. so.. These newbies are called crow bags. Uh, well, it's slang going for newbies because, (when) under pressure, they start flapping about a lot. That means under pressure, they start losing their mind a bit and they start running back and forth just for no reason. Like crows...

Richard: Yeah…

Jack: If you say... shoot a crow, they'd go, they stopped flapping their wings a lot and start flying away.

Richard: Yeah...

Jack: So, hence you'd be called crows. But there's also another term which they give newbies which is a NIG - N. I. G. Which means new in Garrison...

Richard:  New in Garrison…? And what's a Garrison? 

Jack: Garrison is basically a... they say it's a group of different regiments. 

Richard: What's a regiment? 

Jack: A regiment is a body of the people, uh, working towards, uh...well, each regiment has a different, uh…. different… 

Richard:  Different job…Right? 

Jack:  Job.. right. That's right. A different specification to them. So.. one regiment which is engineering. One regimen will be medical, one regiment...so on, and so on. Um, and in a Garrison, there are so many various different types of regiments. This one, Garrison and a newbie is called… A NIG..which is ‘New in Garrison’. 

Richard: New in Garrison...Okay. Very interesting. I did not know that. Uh, what were your first few days like, and what was boot-camp like? So Bootcamp, for those of you who don't know, is the initial training, right? The first training you do in the army. So,  what was that experience like..? 

Jack: So.. training itself is split into two. One is phase one and phase two. Um, if you're an infantry soldier, uh, it varies...now. If you're an infantry soldier,  or if you're actually going to be a bit more specialized, such as the artillery, engineers, medical, so on and so on… 
Richard: Just one quick moment. Uh, artillery means…? 

(The image above is of an artillery weapon.) 

Jack:  Artillery means the big well if you see the movies, the big cannons you see…

Richard: The big guns…? 

Jack: We don’t call it… guns are… Guns for us...Yeah, that is it. It’s guns. That's right. They’re called the big guns. That's right. And a normal personal weapon is called a rifle, soldiers refer to it as a rifle.

Richard: Alright, *got you.

TIP - You can use the phrase “got you” to confirm to another person that you have understood their idea.

Jack:  So in, in basic training, there (are) is two types. So one - the phase one...phase two, but from infantry, it is, uh, it's basically the whole lot is just one phase. Uh, which is..across three to four months long, and they're based in North Yorkshire and out of it gives a specific area where it is basic North to Oculus or their base. ???

Richard: It's in England, right? 

Jack:  That's right.. in England, um, it’s the Yorkshire Dales. That's what, you know, everyone knows it as. 

Richard: Yep. 

Jack: Yeah. The lemony cups of tea…

Richard: Yeah…(laughs) 

Jack: and for...for myself, I've been to a more specialized department, which is obviously the artillery. So, I had to go to phase one training, which was three months in…

Richard: Yup

Jack: in Surry.  Lovely Surry. 

Richard:  Uh, again, in England right? 

Jack: ...in England. That's right. Um, phase one training was actually the most *demanding part of any newbie, because what they like….what they try to do is they break you down. They completely destroy you. 

TIP - demanding as an adjective means requiring great skill or effort. It is different to the verb “to demand” which means to ask for something. 

Richard:  What do you mean by break you down? You mean that they, they want to, to do what exactly…?

Jack: They want to break your confidence. They want to break...So if you come to the army as a very overconfident type of guy, they want to break you down and subject you to authority. 

Richard: Yeah 

Jack: So meaning, and then they want to mold you into their specific type of person (that) they want. This is in order..so (that) everyone will be singing on the same song sheet of the same book. There'll be… (interrupted).

Richard: So that's something that's a great idiom. So... to be singing from the same songbook or song sheet means to be all doing the same thing. Another idiom, very similar to this is to be on the same page...

Jack: That’s right. 

Richard: ..to all be doing the same thing, to conform.

Jack: Yeah.. that’s right. So it's a lot of uniformity,  in the army it's all about uniformity, wherever you go. So, hence why... phase one, everyone does phase one. So in order to be the same... basic, that's called basic soldiering. 

Richard: Yeah

Jack:  And phase two is where you specialize in your specific trade and whether it be engineering, medical, so on. But infantry is obviously, they're based in the Yorkshire Dales.

Richard: Sure. Yeah. I think, um. That's fascinating. Uh, how they do that and how they actually try to give you the confidence by almost taking it away. 

Jack:  That’s right… 

Richard: In the beginning, and then they build you back up. Right, to…?

Jack: So...so there are stories where, for instance, if...as you all know, you've probably seen the movies where, where, um...there'd be the angry Sergeant or the angry drill Sergeant who's screams and shouts a lot. It's actually true. It does happen in the army and that's what does happen. And what they try to do...is they come into your face, they shout and scream and swear a lot and you have to stand still and… hopefully you don't faint if they've got bad breath. 

Richard: (Laughs)

Jack: But, but yeah, that’s the whole point. You stand there and face it. So, when the pressure, even when they’re shouting at you, you can handle it no problem at all. 

Richard: Yeah. So, it's making you psychologically strong, psychologically tough. Um, okay….so I want to talk a bit more about your experience in the army. Um...did you ever see combat in the army? Combat meaning, uh, fighting..? 

Jack: Battles...

Richard: ...or battle? Yeah. Combat battles. 

Jack: Yes, so when I joined the army, it was in 2011 and I joined in 2011. That's when the UK government was just going into Afghanistan. And as you know, before Afghanistan was, um, was Iraq, uh, which is known as operation Telic TELIC, that’s the operation name. Um, and that was the American government who basically was, you know, UK and America, they're quite close together.

Richard: Mhmm

Jack: And when... if the U.S does something, the U.K also joins in and goes together as well. But as I was saying...yes, as I've seen, I've seen...um, I went to Afghanistan and I was there for some months, uh, in the seven months, uh, there were some harrowing aspects. 

Richard: Harrowing means…?

Jack: Harrowing means.. uh…. what means there was (were) bits where it will give you nightmares.

Richard: Yeah… 

Jack:  Within that seven months…

Richard: Yeah… 

Jack: ...because no day is the same. Every day you have to do various things. One day you'll be just sitting there drinking coffee….maybe. Next day...

Richard:  And getting paid…? 

Jack: ...and getting paid. That's right. 

Richard: My...my tax money. 

Jack: (Laughs) 

Richard: There for you to drink a coffee in Afghanistan, like a holiday. 

Jack:  and sunbathing but then you’re wanting to get a coffee. You got your rifle right next to you and hoping that nothing happens. Uh, and you can have a bit of a chill time for the time being.

(The picture above is of a rifle - a type of gun.)

Richard: So, what were those moments like when it was not so chill then? So I'm assuming that you, you said you did see combat, you did have to fight. Um, most people listening to this will have no idea,  what that experience is like... Can you describe it? 

Jack: Imagine for instance, well, it depends where you’re from really. So say for instance, if someone who.. the listener, maybe is from a * war-torn country like Syria or Libya. 

NOTE - war-torn - is a common term used to describe a country heavily damaged by war.

Richard:  Mhmm…

Jack: They will know what I'm speaking about because that's what their daily life is.

Richard: Yeah...

Jack: For me, it's just the seven months.. that was just seven months. But for them, it's a daily experience.

Richard: Of course…

Jack:  Yeah, so what it is ..is... is you don't know what your next day is going to bring. Are you going to be able to tell that story after the seven months? Are you B..(changes sentence) … Am I really like... Like now will I be able to sit here and say or see my future? You know you don't know. So, you have to go there with a perspective that, you know, I'm going to try my best…

Richard:  Mhmm…

Jack: and look out for my, my, my comrades, and my muckers and… 

Richard: Muckers is…?

Jack: Its comrades…
Richard: Comrades or friends… Yeah. 

Jack: Yeah, that's right. Um, and 

Richard: ...that's a British slang word, right?

Jack: Yeah…

Richard: for 'em…

Jack: Yeah.. because you're mucking together. 

Richard: Yeah...

Jack: That's right. So, so...it's all about looking out for each other, but you know, you always had to have expectations of... well, that's why the training's there for. Training is there to break you down, (and to) to build you up. So, you know….you'd be psychologically strong while you're there, but when you come back, there's a lot of issues related to it as well. 

Richard: Um, so I'm going to use a word now, which I want to introduce first, which is casualty. So...casualty is a victim of either an accident or war. Uh, it could be injured or dead. Um, were there many casualties in your unit? Was that something that you saw a lot of or experienced…? 

Jack: Yes. Um, as I said before, uh...casualties..quite...ah well, it's what is a given of war. 

Richard: Yeah...meaning it's going to happen. Right..?

Jack: It's going to happen. You know...you don't go into war to basically have an argument with birds and come back. 

Richard: Yeah...

Jack: You go into war….

Richard: You're not *tickling each other and..(Laughs) 

NOTE -  Tickling is the act of touching a part of a body in a way that causes involuntary twitching movements or laughter. 

Jack: That’s right…you're going to war basically to exercise...you know what the political (changes sentence) the politics are….So, war is all about politics. 

Richard:  Yeah…

Jack:  You know, the ministers, they paid money to... the... your purse and then you basically go and fight. It's like a *mercenary, but for...

NOTE - Mercenary - a professional soldier hired to serve in a foreign army.

Richard: but for country…?

Jack: ...but for the country. That's right. Um, so yes, there was (were) casualties. And when you see casualties, it brings... a realistic.. and *brings you back to earth. It shows what could happen to you as well... and your just, you're just in a near-miss... you are just, you know…

NOTE - idiom- it brings you back to Earth - it humbles you. 

Richard:  Does it make you appreciate life more..?

Jack: Yes, yes… 

Richard: ...changes..yeah..

Jack: That's right. Yeah. You appreciate life more when you see death right in your face when especially it's not their fault that they died…

Richard: No...

Jack: ..but it was really, really unfortunate. And...you know…question, you know, if I'm actually doing the right thing...am I here for the right reasons? 

Richard: Yeah…

Jack: Why am I here? But then while you're there, you're just trying to somehow do your time, look after your friends, but that is what you are there for... you're not looking out for your ministers or your politics..you know?

Richard: No, you don't fight for…Uhm...Queen…Not really. You fight..yeah...for people you’re around…  Um. Were you given any medals? Do you have anything…

Jack: Yeah…

Richard: ...you do? 

Jack: Yeah. Yes. Um, and when I came back, I was, um, there was a little ceremony held and I was presented with the Herrick medal. 

Richard:  Okay. What would you want to explain what that's for...?

Jack: So Herrick, operation Herrick is what was the term given to, uh, the operation..that was won in Afghanistan. And operation Herrick is...so NATO, which is the North Atlantic Treaty Organization...Okay..? Which consists of America, Russia, uhh… No, not Russia...sorry. 

Jack and Richard: (inaudible speaking over one another)

 Richard:  Sorry… to my Russian students… but yeah. Not in this…club…

Jack: Yeah, sorry about that. (speaking over one another)

Jack: … but.. NATO, it consists of varying different countries and you know...we were, we went under the NATO term, but operation Herrick… a was an operation name given to people who went to Afghanistan... (inaudible)...It's called operation Herrick. 

Richard: Okay, nice. Um, so I've got just two more questions for you today, and then we're going to wrap up or... finish. Um. What were some of the pranks or practical jokes you would play on each other in uh…

Jack: ..on each other?

Richard: Yeah. Did you do a lot of practical jokes? Was this uhh…?

Jack:  Yeah

Richard: … because soldiers are known for uh..yeah (conferring). 

Jack: So...so there, there was (were) some practical jokes...The main, but when I was in training, the main practical jokes that were played was (were) actually by the instructors.

Richard: Okay… 

Jack:  So.. you would come back into your..your...dormitory, which is shared by, you know, nine or 10 people. 

Richard: Mhmm… 

Jack:  Um, and you each had a bed space and this bed space, if you didn't keep it correctly, or if you basically left your lockers open and not locked. This would be trashed. I mean, the bed would be out the window, the beds (inaudible) in the army, the whole point is for you to make your bed every morning. 

Richard: Yeah 

Jack:  As with pristine. There have been points in my army... army career days where I refused to sleep on the bed so I could iron in the night and I'll sleep on the floor. So...so it'd be nice and pristine in the morning for parade. 

Richard: Pristine meaning…? 

Jack: (interjects)  …..pristine. 

Richard: ...perfect right?

Jack: That’s right. Perfect.  Um, so I (inaudible) my iron, and I’d sleep on the floor just so I didn’t crease the bed and it's perfect for the morning.

Richard: Nice… 

Jack:  I used to have spare toothbrushes, which I didn’t use… I never used it. I had, uh, I had a, you always have a toothbrush, fork, knife….Uh, you have a bar of soap, you never use, you have, you have razor (which) you never use. You just needed that there just for show. 

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack: But that makes your life easy because, because you don’t have to change it every single day whilst parade morning, and if you have anything wrong then the instructors have the final laugh…Yes. They…yeah. 

Richard: Okay. So...one final question for today. Hopefully, it's a good one. Um, so I'm interested to know how was the transition to civilian life to normal life, to just being back in the UK and living as a normal person? What was that like? To go from one extreme to….well to...normality, to normal life.

Jack: So the army, to combat this, they've got a thing called decompression zone and which is basically army soldiers who have basically fought in a war. They...they're the Americans. They take it, we beat them. The bridge. We go to Cyprus. 

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack: ...that's the way we decompressed, that is decompression. Decompression means coming back to normal life.

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack: That is for a week. We stay there...we let everything calm down a bit. (inaudible) emotions... our nervous disposition, uh, you know, where we just we’re constantly heightened for the seven months they were at their height... on peak...and…

Richard: Just to explain what that means, you mean your, the limits. Oops. Just hit the mic. (Laughs) Repeat again. Um, so what that means is that you're at the limits of your.. nervousness of your anxiety and everything else. Right? 

Jack:  That's right. So...there are stories where people when they come back here, they suffer  (from) a lot of PTSD, which is post-traumatic stress disorder. 

Richard: Mhmm… 

Jack:  Where, say for instance, as you've spoken to as listeners already about Halloween...fireworks sounds a lot like bombs going off. 

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack:  or gunshots going off...You know, when I first came back, you know, when there was fireworks, it was quite scary, to be honest. 

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack: Not only made me jump, 

Richard:  Yeah. 

Jack:  Right. Because you're... for seven months you're basically at the height of your nervous disposition. 

Richard:  Your anxiety…

Jack: ...anxiety is off the roof. You know everything is just heightened.

Richard: Yeah. 

Jack: And when you come back to normal reality, normal..well…not reality - but normal life. You're coming back to normal life. You know, you're still just trying to adjust back into…

Richard: Yeah, it takes a while. 

Jack: That's right. So it is, it is hard, but there are some who make it, some who was, you know, resort to alcohol and things like that.

Richard: Mhmm… 

Jack: There are some who, you know, they lose everything because of this, but I'm guessing, you know, some, you know, one of the lucky ones. 

Richard: Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Um, so that's everything for today, Jack. But thanks so much for joining me. It's been a great conversation. 

Jack:  Thank you

Richard: Uh, so yeah, thank you so much and I look forward to seeing you here again soon.

Jack: Thank you. 

If you notice any errors or would like me to add something to the transcription please email me at info@lovetolearnenglish.com